Hi David and Doves,
In a post on Five Doves you stated - “Here we have in the feet kingdom …two different materials, iron and clay…”
As shown in my post “Feet of iron and clay - PART 1” (EAR 29th June 2014) - the introduction of “clay” into the final “iron” stages of the Roman Empire’s two divisions demonstrates how foreign invasions and racial and cultural influences affected both eastern and western Rome’s solidarity.
The Daniel 2 vision of the “metallic man” statue shows how, during the “feet and toes” stage of the divided and devolving Roman empire, the mixed “iron/clay” populations that were “partly strong and partly fragile”; would mingle, intermarry and devolve into smaller entities (i.e., nation/states), that would not henceforth stick together as a great united empire. In simple terms the “iron” represents Rome and the “clay” represents the “foreign” element that infiltrated into both portions of the divided Roman Empire and weakened it. The “metallic man” statue is a general vision which describes the decreasing value of the “elements” that made up the four ancient empires that ruled over the Jews during the Diaspora. It also shows the succession order of Babylon, Media-Persia, Macedon-Greece and Rome, until its two-fold division with four rulers and its eventual dissolution into ever smaller “toe” nation/states that contained a mixture of “iron” and “clay” strong and weak elements.
However, the process described in Daniel’s vision did not proceed in the same manner on both sides of the divided Roman Empire. In PART 1, we saw how the Western Roman Empire was affected. Now we will look at what happened in the Eastern Roman Empire.
The end of the Eastern Roman Empire in Daniel’s vision of the “metallic man” statue –
After the Roman Empire was divided into two administrations in 285 A.D., Constantine established the Eastern Roman Empire – New Rome - in the city of Byzantium in 330 A.D., and changed its name to Constantinople (now Istanbul). This eastern division was later called the Byzantine Empire which lasted for a thousand years after the Western Roman Empire collapsed in 476 A.D.
(N.B. What makes history so hard to comprehend, are the constant name-changes that cause confusion!)
However, the Byzantine Empire was the predominantly Greek speaking continuation of the Eastern Roman Empire. [i] From the 7th Century onwards, the extensive territory that was originally occupied by New Rome was eaten away by Muslim incursions, infiltrations and invasions; e.g., Egypt and Syria were lost to the Arabs, and Constantinople the Capital finally succumbed and fell to the Seljuk Turks in 1453. [ii] After 1,100 years of Christian rule in the New Rome/Byzantine era, the invasion by the Turk’s Islamic Ottoman Caliphate ended Roman rule in the eastern portion of the divided 4th Empire, and introduced the foreign “clay” Islamic element into the already existing mixture of Greek, Roman, Berber, Arab, Jew, Bosnian, Persian, and multitudinous racial, and cultural groups that previously existed in North Africa, the Levant, Asia and the Middle Eastern territories, commonly called the Fertile Crescent.
“After the fall of Constantinople, Mehmed (Caliph) claimed the title of “Caesar” of Rome (Kayser-i-Rûm), although this claim was not recognized by Western Europe, the Greek Orthodox Patriarch, or the Greeks themselves. Mehmed’s claim rested with the concept that the Byzantine Empire was the carrier of the Roman legacy after the transfer of its capital to Constantinople in 330 A.D.” [iii]
Whether or not Mehmed’s claim was recognized politically by the arrogant Colonial empires of Europe, or anyone else for that matter; the fact remains that the Ottoman Empire established itself as the territorial successor to Rome with the acquisition of Constantinople, the last “jewel” in the Roman crown, and the appropriation of most of the territory previously occupied by the Byzantine Empire in the Levant (The Mediterranean area between Anatolia and Egypt.) However, after remaining for nearly 500 years as the successor to the Eastern Roman Empire; (because of internal nationalistic revolts and its alliance with Germany during WWI) the Ottoman Empire, (described as “the sick man of Europe” by the Russian Tsar) was carved up at the end of the war by the victorious Triple Entente nations (French Republic, British Empire and Russian Empire) and today all of its territories exist as multiple independent states in the Balkans, the Middle East and as the Arab nations.
“The partitioning of the Ottoman Empire (30th October 1918 – 1 November 1922) was a political event that occurred after World War I. The huge conglomeration of territories and peoples that formerly comprised the Ottoman Empire was divided into several new states. The partitioning brought the creation of the modern Arab world and the Republic of Turkey. The League of Nations granted France mandates over Syria and Lebanon and granted the United Kingdom mandates over Mesopotamia (today’s Iraq) and Palestine (later divided into Palestine and Transjordan). The Ottoman Empire’s possessions on the Arabian Peninsula became the Kingdom of Hejaz and the Sultanate of Nejd (today’s Saudi Arabia) the Mutawakkilite Kingdom of Yemen, and the Arab States of the Persian Gulf.” [iv] (today’s UAE)
Thus the eastern division of the old Roman Empire also dissolved into 10 “toe” “iron/clay” incompatible tribal/national elements that have frequently been hostile towards one another and have never reunited. As a result, the Ottoman Empire was signed out of existence with the stroke of a pen in 1922; the Republic of Turkey was established in 1923, and the role of Caliph was abolished in 1924. The partitioned areas eventually achieved independent nation status when the mandates were ended during the 20th Century. There was no victorious conquering empire to continue the line of eastern succession; the age of Empire in the east ended in 1922.
However in 1922, the age of Empire in the west was not quite completed, even though the “iron/clay” feet and toes nations were evident on the World stage in the form of the League of Nations; (which to my mind brought the vision of the “metallic man statue” to an end). It is at this point, from 1922 onwards that we must “swap horses” so to speak, and embark on the next stage of the historical journey which relates to the vision of the 10 horns on the 4th beast and the “little horn” that rose up among them, which finally ended the succession of empires in the west.
The “little horn” vision in Daniel 7:8, 11, 19-22 brought the western succession to an end –
To understand what happened next, we need to refer to Daniel’s more specific vision about the end of the “dreadful and terrible” 4th beast, where the formerly depicted western “iron/clay feet and toes” stage of the divided Roman Empire is presented in new symbolism; as the 4th beast that has devolved into 10 “horns”. These 10 western “horn” nations were named as founding members of the League of Nations in 1920 - Britain (U.K), Netherlands, Belgium, France, Spain, Portugal, Switzerland, Italy, Greece, Yugoslavia - (Kingdom of the Serbs, Croats, & Slovenes). It was amongst these 10 “horn” nations that another “little horn” was to arise whose aim was to re-establish the “dreadful and terrible” 4th beast Roman Empire as the 3rd Reich.
World War II and its aftermath -
The “little horn” that came up after the others and caused so much chaos in this coalition was Germany. Germany joined the League of Nations six years after its formation on 8th September 1926, but withdrew in October 1933 to rebuild its army in opposition to the Disarmament Conference after WWI; thus breaching the Treaty of Versailles, which eventually precipitated WWII. We could note that -
> The “little horn” comes from the fourth “dreadful and terrible” (Roman) kingdom. Daniel 7:23, 24
> It comes up among 10 contemporary horn nations. v.8, 20, 24 (i.e., League of Nations members in Western Europe – post WWI)
> It appears after the first horns. v.8, 24 (Six years later)
> It subdues, plucks out by the roots, three other horns. v.8, 20, 24 (after annexing Austria, Czechoslovakia, and Poland to make more room for itself), the 3rd Reich then attacked France, Netherlands and Belgium.
> The “little horn” is different from the first horns. v. 24 (Most of Germany previously existed outside of the Roman Empire, i.e., north of the Rhine and Danube.) Is this one of the reasons it is called a “little” horn?
> In the horn were the eyes of a man. v.8, 20, (A man rules, from within the 3rd Reich “little horn”)
> Its appearance was greater than its fellows. v.20 (He was a dictator who grew large from small beginnings)
> In the horn was a mouth speaking pompous words. v.8, 11, 20, 25 (Political leader spouting propaganda)
> He spoke pompous words against the Most High. v.25 (His grating and aggressive oratory against God’s people)
> He made war against the “saints” (Daniel’s word for Judah/Jews) and prevailed against them. v. 21
> He persecuted the saints of the Most High. v.25 (The Holocaust)
> He intended to change times and law. v.25 (He altered historical facts and changed laws to disenfranchise and achieve dominance over the Jews and others.)
> The saints were given into his hand for 3 ½ years, (i.e., they were powerless as they were not a nation) v.25 (Gassings began 8th Dec 1941– Germany surrendered 7th May 1945)
> The heavenly court sat and passed judgement on the horn. v.22, 26. (A heavenly decision ended his dominion.)
> The beast was slain and its body destroyed. v.11, 26 (On 30th April 1945 Hitler shot himself.)
> Its body was given to the burning flame. v.11 (Hitler’s aides poured petrol over his body and burned it)
> His dominion is consumed and destroyed forever. v. 26 (Berlin fell 2nd May – Germany surrendered 7th May 1945. Hitler, Berlin and Germany’s 3rd Reich were brought to an end in the flames of war.)
Daniel 7:11
“I watched then because of the sound of the pompous words which the (little) horn was speaking; I watched till the beast was slain, and its body destroyed and given to the burning flame.”
Furthermore, Daniel 7:22, 26, 27-28 shows that it was only after God’s judgement was declared and destruction was wreaked simultaneously on the beast and the “little horn” that the Kingdom was given to the “saints” and Israel was able to return to its traditional homeland in 1948. At this time Israel’s self-determination, dominion and sovereignty over its own affairs was restored and the new State of Israel was declared on 15th May 1948. When the Jews once again received their “kingdom land” in trust from God, the occasion marked “the end of the account” (Cf. Dan 7:28) relating to the vision of the four “beasts”; particularly regarding the 4th beast’s descendant 10 horns and “little horn” vision.
This “end of the account” is in fact borne out by history, because at this point in time, and shortly after the end of WWII; all of the sub-empires descendant from divided Rome, ceased to exist. For this reason the two World Wars were described as “the graveyard of empires”. From this time onwards, the formation of independent nation/states took precedence and in 2013/14 there were about 206 sovereign nations in the World (Wikipedia) and not a single empire was in sight.
As mentioned in PART I, we need to recognise that Daniel’s vision of the “four beasts” ended after WWII when the Jews possessed their Kingdom land in 1948. Cf. Dan.7:17-18, 26-28a. It is at this point that all (and any) “beast” empires ceased to exist. Cf. Revelation 17:8, 11.
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David, I hope the above helps you to understand where the foreign “clay” came from in both eastern and western parts of the divided Roman Empire before both divisions ended with the fulfilment of the vision of the “metallic man statue” in 1920/24. However, I guess you are now wondering… if Daniel’s vision about the 4th beast (Rome) and its horns has also been fulfilled and ended in 1948, then where does the end-time beast empire depicted in Revelation 13 come from?
This is no doubt why you ask in your post regarding the feet of “iron and clay” - “Could this be alluding to the Roman and the Muslims being this last empire.” My simple answer is that the “last empire” in Revelation 13 has nothing to do with Rome. I will answer this part of your query in PART 3 of my reply.
In Christ,
EAR